James Lewis

Transcript

Jeff Shenton: Ok, my name is Jeff Shenton and I’m the instructor of Anthropology 389: Lived Histories at Centre College. I’ll be responsible for recording this interview. This is an interview with Mr. James Lewis. The date today is January 22nd, 2021. This interview is being conducted by telephone and recorded over a Zoom call. The interview is scheduled to last approximately one hour and will consist of an oral history that covers Mr. Lewis’s life and career, focusing on experiences in Danville-Boyle County and on the Urban Renewal period as well as other topics. First, I’d like each of the interviewers to introduce themselves. If you could, give your name, age, your year at Centre, and where you’re from.

James Lewis: Well, my name’s James A. Lewis. Name’s James A. Lewis. My address is 426 Patrician Place, Apt. 3, Danville, KY.

JS: Would you mind giving us your current age, Mr. Lewis?

JL: Um, the age – current age – is seventy-nine.

JS: Wonderful, thank you. Now I’d like the – can I have the interviewers introduce themselves too please?

JL: Yes, please.

Emmy Greene: My name’s Emmy Greene. I’m from Sandy Hook, Kentucky and I’m a sophomore at Centre College. I’m twenty years old.

Stella Ullman: Hi, my name is Stella Ullman. I am nineteen years old. I am a freshman at Centre and I am from Lexington, Kentucky.

JS: Right. Now we can go ahead and start the interview. Thank you.

JL: Ok, thank you.

SU: So Mr. Lewis, could you tell us about your early life, please?

JL: Ok. Now here’s what I’m going from what I remember, what I can recall. I said I was borned – borned in the… on the... Walnut Street in this town. Walnut Street in 1941. 223, yes, 223 Walnut Street. That’s been uh, I’d spend a – I lived down there on best part of Walnut Street. About seven years before we moved, moved again to Green Street, which is now Martin Luther King Street, and lived over there for… until 1958. And during that time there was moved again, back to Walnut Street. Now this was 110 Walnut Street. It was at the top of the hill, over there. So I lived there until after finishing high school and then I went into the service. They got that part, and like the earliest part, and stuff like that, I participated in the sports and was a graduate from Bate High School. What would be a… was an all-Black school building at the time up there in 1960. So after that, following that, I worked at the, part-time for a while at Centre College when I was a, you know, after getting out of school I worked down there for a while and during summer times. And then after that I, uh, got a few little jobs downtown working at the Jan Shoe store and Chen Jeweler and I also worked at the Spoonamore Drugstore for a while, making, making deliveries for the store, those little bikes that could do that. And then, and then soon, it wasn’t long after that in 1963, I got a job back at Centre College for a while again. And then after spending maybe, I’d been there only a couple of months and stuff then I started receiving the draft notices papers from the government so I joined the military services and went into the Air Force in 1963. Spent four years and got out in October 1967. And from then I – after I got out I worked a little bit at uh, on the trash dump, out there hauling trash. We picked up trash. It was a job for a while. And then in the, in that year, that September I went back to work and got back on at Centre College again. I wished, what time I spent, I said 36 straight years. I worked there for thirty-six years at Centre College. Retired in 2004. So other than that I’d say I had my good time in the military service – which was fun. Well I wish I stayed in but I didn’t. But past that, I’ve been round the times that the… otherwise had good decent time around this town. It was a small town. We grew up there on the streets with hung, with hung out there up on Second Street. And that used to be the busy part of town that we’d hang around up on Second Street at the pool hall when we got old enough to get in. We used to couldn’t go in the place until you had a, get a permit or something to get in there. Wouldn’t like that now: it’s a walk in place. If you had a permit to get in then. Well there had a little fun playing pool. And then as I got a little older, like I said, 19 and 20s I’d go up there to the little joints. And they had several little restaurant joints up there. Go in Love’s and play and listen to music on the jukeboxes. Stuff like that. Sometimes we’d play football and basketball and sports. Had fun doing that. Seven keep a from Main Street to down one side of Main Street used to be, used to be where, like I said, a neighborhood. Where a neighborhood, you know, and a few people [sound cuts out] … Was similar to my class in school. My yeah, Main Street was basically— on one side strip we had a, you know there were Black people living in several of the apartments and houses down on one side. I guess they call it the South side of Main Street, and it came from… ran from first – it used to be First Street – ran all the way down to Stanford Avenue, on that side. Like I said, it used to be. The post office got most of that side now down through there. And well there used to be First Street, used to be a little bus station on the corner. Right there on First Street. And used to be a poultry house be right there. And then around First Street, of course there was all Black people lived on First Street there, all straight from First and Walnut. Walnut Street to First Street was Black people lived before, before the Urban Renewal came through during that time. And Mike Knobbs said of the Urban Renewal project thing, you know, when something came up and they started to, just started taking over the old buildings in town, all down Second Street. Because in Second Street area, like I said there was houses lived – I mean Black people lived in houses on Second Street down to the Green Street because the Green Street was all Black. We made from Stanford Avenue to West Green Street; down through there it was all Black. Black folks lived there. Because Black folks lived on Third Street. And Urban Renewal came down through all that. Seems like it was mainly the Black area of towns that they went to. From what I’m seeing they took – they had, they decided to clean up. And especially the Seventh Street part. They took out the few buildings they had up there. And then there was a big building on Walnut Street near First Street. It was called the UBF Hall. It was a big building added, because during the time it was turned into everything. It used to have a skating rink in it. On the second floor they had a skating rink, a stage. And they used to have a little party room up there. A dance place up there. Used to, used for kids. And on the first floor of the place they had a furniture store and a used store, a used furniture store, up there. What I’d like to do with it. Funeral homes, couple of funeral homes down there on the East end of Walnut Street with Smith Jackson and Bright. There was a couple of good funeral homes. And after that. . . Urban Renewal came through. They got Second Street and Third. And then the Third Street area… Well they took over over the South end of Third Street. That was mostly Black places down there. Course it’s still-- still a few people down in there, but they came through and they replaced some of the homes. But some of the people were allowed to buy it back, some of the new buildings and stuff.

I lived down in that area uh, off of Third St., they came through and got that done-- what was it-- Irish Court. Oh Irish court. And they came and they came and got through there and I moved out. And that was in, 19- what. 1980-- yeah 1982 when they came through it. That’s my part of urban renewal. Like that most of the doings was going on as I was-- during the time when I was in-- doing-- in service, I didn’t pay much attention. This was, that was up in uptown-- we called it uptown up in Second St. I didn’t see much of what they was doing to that. Turned all of-- all of Second St. into the State Park up there. And they turned that into the park. Up across the street from the (). Ephraim McDowell used to be a big () on a centerpiece lined up against-- up against a couple of buildings that were run by Black people. Restaurants and stuff on that side (). Ephraim Dowell was blocked in, so I guess they wanted to clear that out. So they got it cleared up.

Up there, it’s a whole different scene on Second St. now from what it used to be. You got uh, on the corners there used to be-- used to be filling stations on each corner. There’d be a filling station across from the church, on Second St. side, and one on the corner on the Walnut St. side. And then a filling station on the corner of uh, Main St.-- on uh, Second and Main St. down there, right at the corner by the park. Of course, there was the bus station. On Main St. We used to have that little bus come in and swing down Second St. and then cut through the back, come out through a little tunnel. Back-- going back to Main St. That was where it unloaded up under there. That was a divided, separated place. Whites and colored. () it was up under there. We had separate water fountains. Separate water fountains under there. And then I’m guessing there was a-- during that time I guess it was normal, you walking down the street. Especially on Main St., you know. White folk going down the street, you had to step off. I remember that (). It’s been a-- it’s been pretty rough-- but it wasn’t all that bad rough—() it still wasn’t all that rough. But it was just the things-- negative things that you had to do that didn’t make sense to nobody. You go to the restaurant to get something you always went to the back-- through the back door of some place like that. But that-- like I said-- that was the times. () little town, seeing could fall into-- into place with what’s going on. They kinda resisted for a while, but uh, we got things fine from the time we had a few little sit-ins. And a couple little marches and stuff. And everything so. But it uh-- seemed like they’d get their little step-- they’d get a little ahead of everybody else. . . And we’re doing pretty good in that way. Otherwise, I think Danville’s been a good little town. Still a lot of stuff, I remember I said, south end of town. Once you got to the south end of town, you was going down () town , about what it used to be. At the top-- at the top of 4^th St hill. And you got up there, there was the park was. Back then-- like I said back then-- you was going out there. You was on the Hustonville Rd. Cause there used to be a-- used to be a lot of farmland out there. Farmland. Until they started developing that through there. So I’m, I hope I’m saying the things that are right, but that’s what I know about this-- about this area. Do y’all have anything y’all wanna say?

SU: Um, so Mr. Lewis, could you tell us kind of what it was like moving around in your childhood? Why did your family--

JL: Oh uh. We moved from Walnut St. down to-- we had to move from uh-- we had to move when the urban renewal came through, you know, from Irish Court. Cause they wanted the place. And we had to move out to the south end of town-- further, we moved further on the south end of town. But yeah, that was the first big move. I didn’t move much, we stayed kinda close. Yeah. [mic noise]

As a child, I didn’t go nowhere much-- when I was growing up much we didn‘t go nowhere but—[background speaker] moving. Different places I lived, oh I lived in the same place, like I said. Walnut St., Green St., and Walnut St. during that time. Before I was moving around. I said I moved out of Walnut St. when I went into the service. Walnut St. when I went into the service in ‘63. Yeah. But other than that I didn’t move around much. Same area. Yep.

SU: Could you tell us--

JL: Guess I been-- guess I’ve been down through (). But that is-- I guess I could come up with a couple things but I can’t think of them. Now it’s-- it’s been a while ago () different things.

SU: Could you tell us about what the community in that area was like?

JL: *Inaudible*. What was that uh-- that () I got along with. Like I said, we-- we uh-- played all the sports and things. Everything We had uh, playground (). Every summer we had playground, playgroung things opened up for the summer. And each area of town had they own, you know, team to play softball, baseball, and stuff like that, and basketball. You played them games against each area. And you know we played down to Junction City and—and Parksville. That’s when they had Perryville place like that, they had schools back then. And they was all in the area. Yeah it’s the little stuff-- yeah you brought that up. I hadn’t thought about that in a while, yeah but Parksville and even Forkland. During part of this time we played ball down in Forkland, they had ball teams, little teams that played ball. Around there. Yep. It was fun, but yeah. Pretty good in those-- in those kind of games were rivals. Then they had the little, uh, the little football teams. We developed a rivalry too, with them.

EG: That’s fascinating, thank you so much for sharing that. You talked quite a bit about the jobs you held, could you tell us a little bit more about what those were and what you did at them?

JL: Well uh sure, when I worked at Centre College I was a custodian down there. I worked as custodian for uh, the whole time down there. I made the-- I think I came-- I finally made supervisor, made supervisor uh, after about-- after-- I think about 16 years together. It might, It was-- I guess about 16 years there at the job I made-- I finally made a, became a supervisor in the physical plant department down there. I worked there until I think 2004 before I retired. Yeah. I was at Centre. Yeah. Yeah I did everything, I set up-- you know the benches and things, like that?-- they had things like that going on and I helped set up them things. You know, put that through, through two Vice President-- Vice Presidential debates. That took part, some part in those down there too. And they used to be a lot of fun. Used to have-- hold a lot of good bands and things. They had a lot of bands. To come down and play in the old-- in the old ballroom. They had several, they had to come in and play through the years, through there. And I used to work a lot of the social dances and stuff that they-- they had down there. And if it was real real big like that they’d hold it in the gymnasium. Down there. They had several big-- like I said, real national bands. Big stylish bands to play for uh, you know, different events down there during the years. And during the time-- I remember one time down in the-- before they’d even get the market built good, down there. Hootie and the Blowfish played down in the ballroom. I didn’t even know what Hootie and the Blowfish was but there they was. They played that. Yeah. They had the Temptations-- not the Temptations-- uh, whatever I’m saying. Well I know Mary Wells, she played down there. And then, what’s--uh-- the woman singer. Pearl Bailey They’d been down there, down there over in the Norton Center. (). Yeah, they used to have good bands play over there. I don’t know half the bands they have over at Centre now but--. The dude that’s running the Norton Center-- I don’t know. He’s got a different idea of what’s going on with the music or something. But they used to have decent bands national bands. But they had their regular little string band. They have a lot of activities down there, especially around Centre College. And you know what, just a small school as they was, they did have a lot of activity. And good stuff, I thought. ‘Cause that was the place. Yeah.

EG: Wow that’s really interesting--

JL: Yeah. See, a lot of the buildings, new buildings and newer stuff. Like I said, a lot of the newer buildings I haven't even-- I haven’t been in none of the newest, you know, renovation phase of the space. I haven’t been in none of the newer dorms like that they built over there near Yerkes. And Yerkes area is the new ones. The ones up front I tell about, up front Main St. right next to Yerkes I haven’t been in none of them. I haven’t been in those up in Bate Ave., I haven’t been in neither one of them either. But I know the buildings. And I haven’t been in through the new addition to the library down there or the new college science building over there. And Olin Hall, haven’t been there either for a while. But, uh, they’ve done pretty good through there over the years and built up real good.

Yeah. Just uh-- I think President Roush is a good fella. Did that when he was there. But, I don’t know. Maybe I can think of something else, got another question?

EG: Thank you! Could you also tell us a little bit more about your time with the Air Force?

JL: Okay, like I said. Air Force I was basically I was a-- I worked in-- in the air freight department. What they call the air freight department. That was in uh, a line load man, line load man. I worked with the loading of a cargo and stuff on the planes. So whatever stuff had to get moved. We had to work to load the planes with all the stuff. I’ve loaded-- well I’ve loaded you know, tanks and jeeps and buses and everything else and everything like that. Had to get those on the plane. And mail. Different kinds of cargo. And they had to know exactly where to put the stuff on the plane. So you were responsible for it. Each plane had its own compartments in it. Each compartment had a weight limit, and a plane had to weigh-- it had to be evened out. So it could fly. Otherwise you’d get the plane out of weight or out of kilter much and the plane might not stay up too long.

And but that was basically it in my time going out. Worked, went to work, went in and got off and stayed around a little bit. Go to the club. Went up to the club and saw uh… That was the first time I ever heard of a Charlie Pride. Went in and saw him at a club at one of the – what they called the Airman Club over there. Didn’t know who Charlie Pride was. But I sure found out.

Country dude. And then they had a, who used to have uh, Nancy Wilson over there. And uh, seen those and some people the names I forgot. Those three girls singing “Be My Little Babe” seems like. Well anyway some decent bands that play over there too I just can’t remember all of them. But when I was in the Air Force that’s what it was; I worked that line. And I was stationed in… in the. I left for basic training down in the San Antonio, down at Lackland Air Force base training down there and, for a while. And in the second phase of my training I went to Wichita. Went to Wichita down to, Sheppard Air Force base to do my second phase of training. And you know, had to go to school. You had to go to. . . .It was six weeks of schooling to do some, to training how to, you know, how to work with the planes which was, you know, the system of the unit of measurement and how the use the slide rule and all that stuff to get your weights and things in line wherever they should be. It was best to take each–. You have a cargo to manifest and everything going on there, but. Yeah. It was fun, expect I’d have to get back there and do that march some. Get up at 3:30 in the morning. Get up at 3:30 in the morning and get out of bed and do them marches. Marches over to the, hospital, the hospital to the kitchen, dining area. Put us in there for a while to work with they called “KP.” And I worked over in that dining hall, like I said, for six week until my class started. And class didn’t start until I got the– several classes already – class already started. Said, “Wait ‘til the next class came up.” So for six weeks I had to pull KP at the hospital, just washing the dishes and cleaning the pots and pans, and mopping the place up. Cleaning the place up. That was every day. And we’d go in, like I said, we’d get there by 4 o’clock in the morning and start working and didn’t get off ‘til everything was through. That might be 11 or 12 that night. So you had to, you was pushing time. But after school got started it kind of lightened up and gave you a little more time to do something. Yup. And one of the main things though, I was the – I was there in Texas in route to Sheppard base out from San [Antonio]. In route to, there was this day – it was in a little eat and stop place where they always stopped to eat lunch and stuff. And that was the day that, um, John Kennedy got shot. He was in Texas – we was in Dallas that day– and we was, he got shot that same day. So that was a, that was a big thing there. Then I was down there in that Texas area at that time. And I – because they rushed all us little young dudes back on them buses and they took off. Then get off a bus again until we got to Shepherd and we went straight into the barracks where we were put on lockdown right then. Everything was in lockdown. They went into alert. It was gonna be, you know we was gonna have another war that day or not. They put us in lockdown until everything was all clear. Yeah, I do remember that. I’ll never forget that day. Um hm Basic training wasn’t bad but wasn’t much you could – nothing to do but it was all right. It was better. And I chose the Air Force because some thing I feared the Army didn’t particularly care for — like they do a lot of up and down and marching and stuff in the Army. I like where the certain time, certain time we was done with our stuff. We didn’t stay in training and stuff all the time. You know except for war. It was different there. They ain’t have what we stayed in the classroom duty for a while. Although we were trained in some of the fields activities. Like that, we would go out through there and crawl around in the mud and dirt and stuff. We were doing a little basic training. Climbing up walls, scaling down walls and stuff. And we had to fire little rifles. Get our little rifles together. When we’d go to the firing range you can understand why ( ) was any qualified on a rifle, then your rifle went back and you never saw that rifle again unless they need to. You was, it was locked up and chained up. Don’t get it ‘til you get reissued. That thing when I was in Korea got the – we got called on an alert. Had an alert on the nightly. An alert that there early one morning, they always did it early in the morning. That 2:30, 3 o’clock come this alert. You had to jump up, get dressed, try to get dressed and grab all your equipment. Try to, try to find your equipment if you can, just to put on and run– run down to, uh, the armory room to pick up your, the rifle, pick up your rifle. And then when you got that, then they, then they finally gave you a number for you to get you a rifle. And you got to a rifle when that you lined up. You lined up with your troop to be a pass. This was when I was in Korea. That was a place. That was definitely a different place to what I was used to being in. It’s sort of run down. Let’s just say it was all. This was just shortly after, you know, shortly after the Korean War. 10 years but still. They were still kind of rocky over there. But other than that, I’ve been in Korea. I stayed in Korea for 13 months. 13 months I was over there, and then I – then I went to – then I went – went to Germany. Went to Germany. My next station was assigned in Germany so I had – couldn’t –. Second consecutive tour of duty overseas, you know. That was four years I was there. I went to-- went to Rhein-Main, had a base in Germany-- in Frankfurt, Germany. I was over there for most of the time. During that time and stuff I had got sent on what they called “temporary duty assignment,” in which I was sent back to… sent back to Hawaii. I worked-- I was supposed to be going to a little island… What was it? A little island… Marshall Island? Well it was a little island out there. Wake-- Wake Island, yes! I was supposed to be going to Wake Island and stationed but I didn’t get to Wake Island until we got to Hawaii and they kept us-- they kept us in Hawaii. So I went to-- they got three months down in there in Honolulu, Hawaii, down in there. Hickam Air Force base. That, was a nice place to visit but I couldn’t handle it, it was expensive being, as it was still special dime down there. Very nice weather… And yeah. That was military time. Oh another thing-- another thing was that I was there one Christmas for… And that was in, while I was in Korea-- winter, the wintertime, Christmastime, I was there for one of the, went to one of the Bob Hope, one of the Bob Hope of Christmas shows that they put on, you know, that they supposed to do every year with the troops overseas. And you just had to come to the-- to our base in Korea. So I got to, you know, like I said, I got to unload, got to unload his plane and got to move all the their equipment and stuff. I had that plane. Well then, I met, I didn’t meet anybody directly but I met him and, was it uh… Liza Minnelli? You know it was, settle up... I can’t even think of the names. It was always on his tour with him most times.

Yeah. And what I think that, was it, was that woman Rhonda ()? Does it sound like that? Rhonda. Yeah. It was another woman on that… There was several people on that. I met-- I know-- I met that Jared Mahone I mean Jared-- I think it was ( ). But I do remember Bob Hope. And Bob was a little short. He was shorter than what I thought he was. [Laughter] Little Bob. But they come and did a good show down in the hanger, one of that aircraft hangars, so. We came to see him there. And… yep. Alright... That’s about it. Trying to think of what else you want to know.

SU: Thank you so much.

JL: Yeah. Hm?

SU: Could you talk about how living in Danville now, do you feel like it’s changed from when you were young?

JL: Ooh. It’s changed-- it’s changed a little. They need to do a little more. It is more uh-- yeah it’s definitely a different town. Yeah, I remember, like I said, you used to- to read a sign- they had a sign right down Stanford Avenue. And in the sign one they had population of Danville’s 5,800 more than I remember that sign. I think Danville’s a little bit bigger than that now. So it’s done changed, isn’t it. It changed a lot- the in--, yeah. It change-- after they-- it used-- they need to use some of these change and bring some business in and needs to stop being so stubborn about how tall they make a building, too. Build a 10-foot-- I mean 10 story building, let ‘em build one! But right now they don’t allow nothing like that. If () this hard to get a foot up around this place, and that’s what they need to do—that way wouldn’t take up so-- if they let ‘em build a bigger building they wouldn’t take up so much space building. Right now we spread out. We’re spread out. We could have gotten.  . . We’re not really moved so much. We’re not letting nobody in. Except restaurants. Don’t eat that much stuff out. Everybody don’t eat out. We need no more restaurants. Somebody-- we’re talking about restaurants now – we don’t need no more restaurants - and they want to put another restaurant out here on the by-pass. By the coattails. We don’t need no more, I don’t think. Nothing like that. If they’re gonna do something, build a big one that’s worth something instead of talking to a burger joint. We don’t need no more of them. Everybody assume the same thing. Of course, if they’re building it, if they work, they work; if they don’t, they don’t… They need to build a-- at the Millennium Park they need to build a-- build a decent water pool area out there. That was part of the first intention, I think when they first built it, to have a good pool. But so far, they ain’t got a decent pool out that way nowhere. Swimming pool, a waterpark-like thing. Needs to-- we don’t need no a bunch of baseball and the soccer-- soccer fields. I don’t mind having them, I’m glad we got some, but ( ) same things. Yeah. Especially in the park out there, back to back. But let me tell you, it has changed, it has changed.

SU: Can you talk about the parts of Danville that have changed that you miss the most?

JL: Oh. As much I miss the most. I guess… I can’t say really “miss” but I guess the uptown area. Missing the uptown area. Going, Like I said, going up there and stopping, you know, shooting a game of pool up there on Second Street. We went up the the pool hall. Some of a couple of dudes ran the old barber shop used to be up there. A bunch of men, got an old barber shop. There was one dude up there, like I said, barber shop-- barber shop was the main hangout. Sometimes we’d stop off and play cards and stuff, you know. And pinochle card games at the barber shop. That was fun stuff. And checkers. We’d play checkers there, good stuff. But, you know, everything changes. We’d just be-- I was just thinking: used to be a little ice cream place up there on Second Street too, where they had like a Dairy Frost. A Dairy Queen-- I mean little Dairy Frost. Little thing like that. They had the little soft ice cream cones right there. Used to be up on Second Street too. I think-- what’s his name-- Stuart Davis ran it up there on Second Street… there for a while. But yeah that’s one of the things I kind of miss that. If they’re gonna built all this-- keep building up and building and build right… But they doing ok. We’ll get there. A note that the hospital up there is doing pretty good. It’s building up. It’s building up pretty good all place. They want to move-- moving a building. Got just as much stuff as some of the bigger cities have-- we got everything they have. On a smaller scale, but we got it. Yeah. I’m trying to think of what else was going on. We… ok. . . one. . .

JS: Do you have other questions?

JL: No, I’m all right, I guess. I guess I remember some-- I remember-- God, I’m still thinking about it. I remember when we used to have in town where we used to have a lot of fruit trees and stuff. Fruit trees-- someone was just talking about it down there. Used to have some apple trees in several places. Plum trees, peach trees, and pear trees-- was all of town -- cherry trees. It was all over the place. And plum, persimmons trees. It was all over. With those little berries all over them-- these mulberry trees. Call the rest of them, that’s all you’d be around. You don’t see nothing like that now! Especially… that’s all I guess-- that’s about all I got to have right now.

JS: Mr. Lewis, do you know-- you worked at Centre College for a long time.

JL: Yes, sir.

JS: Do you know anything about Centre’s relationship to the community and the African-American community in Danville and their role in Urban Renewal at all? Do you have any thoughts on Centre College in that regard?

JL: Well, I know they always-- as far as I know they always hired, you know, had the Black people on the staff. Now matter of fact most of all they had-- except for the skilled-- the skilled jobs-- they had-- you didn’t have many skilled jobs until you had the later years, you know. But other than that, as far as work, that was it. The work staff. Especially in the housekeeping and stuff. Was mostly the-- most all Blacks. Didn’t have the . . .didn’t have no White people working the housing department except maybe one or two. In the-- in the later years it was all, like I said, we was all later years and then they started-- started hiring White people. But other than that, it didn’t-- didn’t cause—Centre has been good in that way. Anyway at the dinning halls, you know the whole cook staff and all that used to be Black and stuff over there too. That used to be… That was it. But other than that, Centre ties-- Centre done a-- Centre has been an employer around town. They’ve been a used to be you didn’t have a job you could find something down there. Yeah.

JS: So you’d say you appreciate the role that Centre College has played for you over the years? You appreciate them or do you have any-- any thoughts about… about, you know, Centre College’s role in the-- in the community at all?

JL: Like I said, I think they’ve been pretty good so far as I know. And role, I don’t have much thought about it except-- except I didn’t get paid enough but I’m all right. They didn’t pay me enough but I’d be all right. I like-- I made--. Like I said, I think they’ve done pretty good. I don’t have many-- nothing to object them from so far.

JS: All right. Well, before I let you go, is there anything about your own life or experience or your history that you would like to-- to put on-- to put on record here today that you haven’t talked about yet? Anything from your own past or your own experience?

JL: Like I said, I haven’t done anything spectacular or anything. . . I just been here a done that. I haven’t-- tried to get by and make a living and get by by myself. [laughs] If I haven’t done anything worthy-- I don’t think. I’ve just bene here and been me and been around a little bit. So that’s-- that’s it.

JS: Sounds to me like you’ve done quite a bit in your time.

JL: Well I’ve had to spend time doing what I had to do, you know, had to do at that time, and try to stay-- say—safe. I mean one thing, when I was young I got the dude-- had a dude pull a gun out on me. One guy with the ole KSD pull a gun out on me one time and tap me on-- tap me on the leg. Never get to ( ). ( ) gun tap the ( ) get my leg. Said if I ever come on KSD again he was gonna shoot me. [Laughs] Drive by ( ) in a strawberry patch and he sent the whole gang down there. And they trapped me before I got across there to the creek. [Laughs] I was running. That was the first time they ever had missed that creek but I missed that creek and jumped right in the middle of it, so. They got me. But other than that-- big time excitement.

JS: I didn’t catch this-- what was it that they said you had done?

JL: Thought I was in the-- in the strawberry patch. They used to have a strawberry patch over there on school ground. We used to cross the-- cross the street, climb the fence and go in and get at the strawberries. Until one day he said-- he sent the whole crew of the deaf and dumb boys sown to get us. And I was running, there was a little creek that ran through the-- through the ( ), and you used-- like I said-- you just jump over the creek but that particular day I miscalculated my jump. Instead of jumping over the creek, I jumped right in the middle of it. [Laughs] And they got me, marched me right up in the middle of that street. Right past my house! Marched me right on straight past my house and took-- took me right on across the street over to the little office area. And he did-- never did tell that little old man pull a gun out on me. Had a little ole silver in his back pocket. [Laughs] [woman in background “how old?”] But it’ll be a -- I was about ten or eleven.

JS: Well that sounds like quite an experience. Any other follow up questions that you two have?

JL: That’s about it. I probably think of everything once you get off here but for now that’s about everything. That’s about it right now that I can think.

JS: All right, well if there aren’t any more questions, I’ll thank you for your time. Thank you so much for spending this time with us and sharing your story. And--.

JL: I hope you can use it--.

JS: Go ahead.

JL: I hope that whatever it is, you can use it. If you can’t, just trash it [laughs].

JS: All right, well it’s been a pleasure speaking with you this afternoon and I want to thank you for your time. Thank you so much.

JL: All right. Thanks, yeah. Thanks for asking me to-- letting me participate because I don’t usually do nothing like this, and this kind of surprised the () but I gave it what I had.

JS: That’s great.

JL: You all have a great day.

JS: You too. Bye-bye.

JL: Ok, bye.